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Subject: Re: [DCHAS-L] Seeking Safety Material for Training Undergrad Lab TA's
Date: Wednesday, August 29, 2018 at 3:42:09 PM
Author: "Kennedy, Sheila" <s1kennedy**At_Symbol_Here**UCSD.EDU> 		Next by Date:
Subject: Re: [DCHAS-L] Justification for lower cap for teaching labs
Date: Thu, 30 Aug 2018 12:34:55 +0000
Author: Pam

From: Alan Hall <oldeddoc**At_Symbol_Here**GMAIL.COM>
Subject: Re: [DCHAS-L] Justification for lower cap for teaching labs
Date: Wed, 29 Aug 2018 15:16:46 -0500
Reply-To: ACS Division of Chemical Health and Safety <DCHAS-L**At_Symbol_Here**PRINCETON.EDU>
Message-ID: CALDugaZsh-k6Lvg25NLeFzohv46TgC-PoPTWVd14SHtheiiR9g**At_Symbol_Here**mail.gmail.com
In-Reply-To


Pamela,

A personal anecdote, but perhaps relevant.

When I was an undergrad pre-medical student, we had a new science building and the chemical laboratory was in the basement (not a good design). Ours was an evening class,and without notifying the TA or professor,
maintence had shut down the complete HVAC system (incluiding fume hoods).

We were cooking up some idiotic stuff which off-gassed hydrogen bromide into inverted funnels into a sodium hydroxide dilute solution bath. 40+ student groups did so, and when all of us started to have quite disturbing eye and respiratory irritation,the TA told us to evacuate. NOBODY turned off the Bunsen burners and when the Fire Department showed up (properly equipped), they were not happy campers. And neither were we.

So, yes, TA's should be trained in safety and classes limited to those which a professor or a TA can handle. They have to learn somehow, but not by being at risk.

My 2 cents worth.

Alan
Alan H. Hall, M.D.
Medical Toxicologist
Clinical Assistant Professor
Colorado Schoolof Public Health
Springtowm and Azle, TX
OldEDDoc**At_Symbol_Here**gmail.com

On Wed, Aug 29, 2018 at 10:26 AM, Harry J. Elston <helston**At_Symbol_Here**midwestchemsafety.com> wrote:
Jim - can you point to a reference for that? SBC (Southern Building Code), IBC (International) or other?

Thanks,

Harry

On Wed, Aug 29, 2018 at 9:24 AM James Kaufman <jim**At_Symbol_Here**labsafety.org> wrote:
Pam,

Take a look at the building occupancy load in the building/fire codes. It is normally limited to 50 sq ft per person in labs in educational occupanies.

PS. "There's more to lab safety than just labs!"

James A. Kaufman, Ph.D.

Founder/VP of Education
The Laboratory Safety Institute (LSI)
A Nonprofit Educational Organization for Safety in Science, Industry, and Education

192 Worcester Street, Natick, MA 01760-2252
508-647-1900 Fax: 508-647-0062
Cell: 508-574-6264 Res: 781-237-1335
Skype: labsafe; 508-401-7406

jim**At_Symbol_Here**labsafety.org www.labsafety.org

Teach, Learn, and Practice Science Safely




On Tue, Aug 28, 2018 at 8:57 PM Pam <aubu**At_Symbol_Here**hotmail.com> wrote:

Currently the labs classes here are capped at 32. I know that the ACS recommends no more than 25. Are there any other sources I can quote as a draft a letter to our Dean to lower the cap in chem labs. We are a two year school so when I say that labs are capped at 32 that would be ONE pair of experienced eyes in the room. There are no TAs.


I am also looking into the square footage of the room


Right now I am working with groups of 4 so not all students are getting a true lab experience. Some are just watching


Thanks


Pamela Auburn, PhD
2041 Branard
Houston TX 77098
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Harry J. Elston, Ph.D., CIH
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